Oral timing for kickstarting a cycle

[didsmith123]

Bear with me here chaps....i've had this discussion with el chapo over on ukm and even he admitted its an interesting question

if your starting a cycle with long esters...is it wise to take the oral of your choice straight away e.g. on the first day of your first injection?

my reason for questioning this is say your kickstaring with 40mg dbol on a 500mg testc cycle for say 12 weeks...just an example..not a plan lol....then surely due to the ester not releasing the fu;ll potential of the test until the 4 week mark your actually taking 40mg of dbol for 4 weeks with very little test in your system....i know test seeps into your system during that time but you wont get fully system saturation for a month due to the ester

would it be wiser to wait until the 4 week mark to start taking your oral when the test is fully in your system and ready to help with any adverse symptoms of running an oral with very little to none test in your system if you follow me

anyway always a pleaseure chaps

many thanks for any replies

 

[Functional Fitness]

Bear with me here chaps....i've had this discussion with el chapo over on ukm and even he admitted its an interesting question

if your starting a cycle with long esters...is it wise to take the oral of your choice straight away e.g. on the first day of your first injection?

Yes, but only if you're eager for small gains/effects before the injectable kicks in. Short esters=quick gains. That's the entire point of using them in a nutshell.

my reason for questioning this is say your kickstaring with 40mg dbol on a 500mg testc cycle for say 12 weeks...just an example..not a plan lol....then surely due to the ester not releasing the fu;ll potential of the test until the 4 week mark

1. That doesn't make sense and it's also false.
2. You're overthinking and complicating things for yourself.

 

[Functional Fitness]

(1)surely due to the ester not releasing the fu;ll potential of the test until the 4 week mark your actually taking 40mg of dbol for 4 weeks (2)with very little test in your system....(3)i know test seeps into your system during that time but you wont get fully system saturation for a month due to the ester

1. False.
2. False again.
3. As above but (dependent on injection frequency) you will have raised test levels within the first few days but not "peak" and stable plasma concentrations.

 

[didsmith123]

anyone had any thoughts on this?

 

[ADAM1]

I haven't tried your second option mate so can't give an opinion.
Always found it best when using gear to keep things simple.
If I was using dbol/drol it was always at the beginning of a cycle.

 

[didsmith123]

dont get me wrong mate was just thinking aloud....i've always kickstarted any oral right at the beginning of my cycle ....just seemed like the logical way...but i was nattering with el chapo over on ukm a while back...the only reason i stayed on there to tell the truth ..far far too many wannabees and google warriors for my liking and bounced off the idea that due to long acting esters not allowing full plasma saturation until the 4 week mark give or take was it a possibility that there might be a cause for adjusting timing of said oral....he concurred but said unless you were to take bloods every week until the 4 week mark passed and the ester had released the full potential of your steriod of choice there was just no difinitive answer...now this bloke is an endocrinologist by trade and if you fancy a cracking read his thread is very well recieved....just a bloody shame its on that site...just got me thinking and thought i'd bounce it off the chaps on here to see what their thoughts were

many thanks and regards

 

[darrenG10]

My understanding is peak plasma levels of certain dose builds up but your first injection it’s working as in raised hormone protein synthesis nitrogen retention

One good thing with oral later on is myostatin levels rise around week 6 off a cycle and dbol has been shown to reduce myostatin levels and then at week 6 you’ll know if testosterone has caused any increased estrogen level which then you’d be on the right dose of ai to combat the the side effect.

especially that dbol also raises estrogen but converts to much stronger estrogen 7a methyl estradiol testosterone dbol combined at the beginning then could cause gyno issues and halt the cycle if not taken care of and you’d need a much higher ai dosage to combat that and possibly letro and serm like nolvadex to reduce binding to the nipple gland

Personally the first 6 weeks testosterone only then dial in ai to keep estrogen in range then at week 6 myostatin is lowering add in dbol to further push gains provide more benefit with testosterone at peak levels and side effects taken care off

 

[TreneBrahh]

I'm with Adam on this. I like my orals at the start. I get impatient If I'm running a long ester like Deca... But then again I run orals the entire time I'm on blast, which can be months at a time. I think I ran 300mg of Anadrol once for like 3 months straight. Never did blood work say I can't say anything more.

 

[didsmith123]

cracking stuff chaps....akways a pleasure..and darren..damn you know your stuff mate..simply outstanding response...amd as for you trenebrahh.. i simply salute you sir wth your adrol dosages..you bloody machine lol

 

[Functional Fitness]

To the OP.

This study might help you with your confusion about testosterone ester release rates, half lives, and peak plasma concentrations.
The study results can be directly transferred to all other hormones/esters (Deca/EQ/Masteron....whatever).

Comparative pharmacokinetics of testosterone enanthate and testosterone cyclohexanecarboxylate as assessed by serum and salivary testosterone levels in normal men - PubMed

The pharmacokinetics of 2 testosterone esters, testosterone enanthate and testosterone cyclohexanecarboxylate, were compared in a single blind crossover study in healthy young men. Their effects on serum and salivary levels of testosterone, as well as on the serum levels of LH, FSH and prolactin...

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

...and here's another section from a different article:

Administration of ester derivatives of testosterone as testosterone enanthate generates an increase in serum testosterone to levels reaching 400% from the baseline within 24 hours of administration. These androgen levels remain elevated for 3-5 days after initial administration.5 Continuous administration of testosterone enanthate shows a significant suppression of dihydrotestosterone, serum PSA, HDL and FSH, as well as a slight increase in serum estradiol. The levels of dihydrotestosterone and FSH can remain suppressed even 14 days after treatment termination.

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[Functional Fitness]

Some more light reading...

The pharmacokinetic profile of testosterone enanthate was studied in a regime of multiple dosing and the testosterone level was reported to present a Cmax above 1200 ng/dl after 24 hours of the last dose. The concentration decreased sequentially until it reached 600 ng/dl after one week. The pharmacokinetic profile of testosterone enanthate presented differences depending on the administered dose in which the tmax was shifted to a range of 36-48 hours. The plasma testosterone level plateaued below the therapeutic range after 3-4 weeks. This reports showed that the different formulation of testosterone enanthate and testosterone cypionate generates a different profile and thus, they are not therapeutically equivalent.

 

[didsmith123]

your alright mate..i've been speaking to an actual endo not pubmed lol

 

[Functional Fitness]

dont get me wrong mate was just thinking aloud....i've always kickstarted any oral right at the beginning of my cycle ....just seemed like the logical way...but i was nattering with el chapo over on ukm a while back...the only reason i stayed on there to tell the truth ..far far too many wannabees and google warriors for my liking and bounced off the idea that due to long acting esters not allowing full plasma saturation until the 4 week mark give or take was it a possibility that there might be a cause for adjusting timing of said oral....he concurred but said unless you were to take bloods every week until the 4 week mark passed and the ester had released the full potential of your steriod of choice there was just no difinitive answer...now this bloke is an endocrinologist by trade and if you fancy a cracking read his thread is very well recieved....just a bloody shame its on that site...just got me thinking and thought i'd bounce it off the chaps on here to see what their thoughts were

many thanks and regards

Stick with the bro-science that exists on every forum if you're that gullible and don't want to do your own "real" research and 'trial and error' based on facts/experience. Every bbing forum has got a resident "expert" guru member that thinks he knows everything about bbing, steroids, diet, training, recovery, life, yadda yadda, and we've got such a guru member on here too.

Follow the in-crowd or use your own common sense? Easy choice really...

 

[Functional Fitness]

your alright mate..i've been speaking to an actual endo not pubmed lol

Pubmed is way above an "apparent" endo posting on a bbing forum as Pubmed is real clinical trials but if you're happy with what this bbing forum endo tells you why post on another bbing forum about what he tells you?

You're not too smart are you. First you post a link that reveals your real name and address in a criminal case...and now this?
Crack on. I'm dodging you like a bullet from now on. No further comment lol.

 

[didsmith123]

does this mean we cant be friends any more? don't say that cos i'll be crushed.....

 

[Functional Fitness]

does this mean we cant be friends any more? don't say that cos i'll be crushed.....

Jog on and don't be a childish troll. I don't want to chat with you ever again and I'll never interact with your posts/topics again.
Extend me the same common courtesy...

 

[darrenG10]

Stick with the bro-science that exists on every forum if you're that gullible and don't want to do your own "real" research and 'trial and error' based on facts/experience. Every bbing forum has got a resident "expert" guru member that thinks he knows everything about bbing, steroids, diet, training, recovery, life, yadda yadda, and we've got such a guru member on here too.

Follow the in-crowd or use your own common sense? Easy choice really...

Nobody likes you black man just go

 

[didsmith123]

i could...and i should...but i can't ...i just can't...so you have a lovely day now....i insist